Makes me wonder what could happen.

[TANEYTOWN]

I find it noble to try & help people from being killed. You do understand that Saddam was killing millions of Iraqi people? It's about time we help North Korea from that killer as well.

[andy]

For you TT!

[TANEYTOWN]

So stopping Saddam from killing anymore Iraqi people isn't noble? For the first time they now have a chance. What's wrong with that? Kind of how we got our chance by kicking England around. Now we all get along. But we had to get out from under their thumb to-do so.

[Palace]

I don't know a great deal about all this because a) I'm not interested and b) I'm not interested. that said, when was it decided that the good ole boys of the US of A were the world's police? I appreciate there are people know a lot more about all this than I; but North Korea, well, I'd imagine if there was something for the good ole boys of the US of A to gain from going in there a whoopin and a hollerin, I expect they probably already would've.

my cause for disquiet is this: I pity you, yet you sicken me. go figure.

[andy]

Taney refines his debating style

[TANEYTOWN]

No hard feelings guys. Just wanted to kick somethings around. You guys are a wild bunch & I dig that.

[NickG]

heil bush ,neo con merchant boy
does Paul Westerberg know you talk shit in his name?

i'm telling on you

[TANEYTOWN]

Never voted for Bush or his Father. I'm 32 years old & have yet to vote Republican once.
I do however understand geo-politics, something you guys were never tote it seems.

[Stuart W]

I find it noble to try & help people from being killed.

Well, best of luck then on your vigil outside "The Walls" at Huntsville, TX

[TANEYTOWN]

I do a lot of work to stop people from being killed by the US Government. I'm against the death penalty.

Hey, guys the pints are on me tonight!

[Dangerbird]

So stopping Saddam from killing anymore Iraqi people isn't noble?

now... that wasn't really the purpose of the invasion was it Taney? If indeed the US' motives were as noble as that, they would've gone in years ago, and they wouldn't have supported the regime in the past. If the US truly cared about such stuff then why aren't they going into Zimbabwe or Burma to fix shit up? truth is, US invaded Iraq for political and resource gain, not to save the poor Iraqi's from Saddam's evil hand.

whether the US is 'winning' the fight or not is irrelevant. I certainly didn't protest the war b/c I thought the US would lose. I protested b/c the motives behind the invasion were not pure, and the process itself would be devestating.

You claim that stopping Saddam from killing is noble. Yet how many deaths has the invasion led to? Just Foreign Policy estimates over 600,000 Iraqi civilians have died as a result of the invasion. AntiWar.com reports 3342 US military personel have been killed in Iraq.

So, pray tell, how the fuck is that noble?

[TANEYTOWN]

People die in war. Were winning even the New York Times has said thee change is real.
Will have a strong hold to watch Iran & that will be better for the world.

[Dangerbird]

People die in war. Were winning even the New York Times has said thee change is real.
Will have a strong hold to watch Iran & that will be better for the world.

So let's get this straight. Bush used 9/11 and imaginary WMD's to justify invading another country, and in the process killing thousands of his own and hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's to be noble and so he can keep an eye on Iran?

your logic astounds me....

[saint carl]

People die in war.

Which is why you don't enter war lightly. The world agreed on a set of principles before a war could be "sanctioned". No matter how bad the regime you can't just go in and "remove" them because you will have the exact same power struggle as is seen and it will be ordinary citizens who are caught up in the civil unrest. Either as casualties or through starvation, disease etc.

You too are mixing up all the enemies in your discussion. When the Saddam terrorism link is dismissed you throw in Iran or Taliban or al Qaeda or whoever best diverts from a very week argument. Stick with one for the sake of the general discussion you keep asking for. Strawmen arguments are for the weakminded.

Summing up your argument to date it seems to be: it was ok to start this war on a reem of lies in order to keep an eye on Iran. And that's it?

The worst thing Taney is this whole "we're winning" attitude. "We" f*cking started it! It's a sickening boast given the amount of people who have been killed. This isn't a game of football, there are no winners.

It's like some jock going into a bar seeing some little nerd enjoying a quiet West Coast Cooler, walking up to him and then just beating the crap out of him for no reason and walking away shouting how he'd won the fight.

Unfortunately though facts and figures aren't always to be believed, especially not official ones. What is worrying is just how many mercenaries are over there. Not including the largets Private Military Force (Blackwater), there were 180,000 PMFs in Iraq employed by the US. There were only 160,000 actual military personnel.

As the official forces are decreased, the PMF increases. Of course, "winning" this whole thing is a lot easier with a bunch of people who aren't accountable to any international agreements or laws of conflict. It also looks better to have living breathing troops coming home rather than a bunch of coffins.

I do wonder if the people of Zimbabwe are wondering how there might be a bit more help coming their way right now if only they had some oil.

[Palace]

I have thought and voiced the very same opinion about Zimbabwe and oil, and I find it puzzling and and disgraceful that the world's police are yet to set foot in that particular neighbourhood. I mean, innocent people are being killed. isn't that the criteria?